Interviewing to Join a Gang

Here's one. A wannabe is asking:

I need to know some of the qeastions to join a gang called folk. Can you give them to me?

Huh?

Here's my answer:

Yeah, I'm not sure about that particular gang. The questions I'm familiar with are these:

1) Do you have a good attorney? Because you'll need one to get you out of all the trouble the gang will get you into.

2) Do you have a nice suit to wear? Because you'll need one to attend the funerals of innocent family members and friends that get killed by members of rival gangs who are shooting at you, but are too doped up and scared to shoot or even see straight.

3) Do you have a good doctor that can treat you for everything from venereal disease to drug overdose to gunshot and knife wounds? Because you'll need one.

4) Do have a nice funeral for yourself planned out and paid for? Because you'll need one -- sooner than you think!

5) Do you have anyone to visit you in jail and prison? Maybe someone to bring you some books or something? Because you'll really be wanting someone to do that, and your homies from the "set" sure won't do it.

6) Are you ready to get gang-banged by the big, hairy felons that have been in prison for the past five or ten years, there 1) with no women, and 2) lifting weights? Because when they see you, they're going to think "fresh meat!" That's assuming you don't get killed on the streets, of course.

Don't worry about getting bummed out while being a gangmember. With all the pain and sorrow and suffering, it will seem like that lifestyle just lasts forever sometimes, but don't worry -- your gang life will actually be alot shorter than you think.

If there's anything more I can help you with, don't hesitate to contact me. If you can't get me, you can contact a Friend of mine, a Guy named Jesus. He's pretty reliable, and He's always alot closer than you think if you decide you need Him.



It's not a job interview you're going on. Think it through...


Mark aka Channelview

"All over a colored flag and a few dollars."

Here's another story I heard recently. I took out the names and did other minor editing:

"I only had one real uncle.... He took care of everybody in my family, making sure we were always safe. Now he's gone, dead, one bullet to the head. All over a colored flag and a few dollars. [He] knew a lot of people, he touched a lot of lives. He will be greatly missed...."

Yeah, isn't gang life cool?

"Living in a Nightmare"

Living In A Nightmare

After burying my own brother, I have seen the world in a different light. I spent some time in jail, and I spent some time living in pain, The pain that you are thinking of is a mental pain that would drive a man to kill himself. Everyday I have to live this pain. I have to live with the fact that I hurt many people and I hurt myself, I even thought a gunshot or a few would make me a real man. I am partially crippled due to my foolish decisions.

I was once in Los Angeles, on the block with helicopters 50 feet off the ground searching at night for drive-by suspects. Holding a cup filled with thunderbird wine, a wine so strong we called it "gangsta juice". I would have that big joint in my left hand with my eyes bloodshot scanning back and forth looking for enemies, and the police who would run up on us. packing a loaded gun at age 10 to standing in front of a burnt out liquor store with my homies. You know I thought that was the world and the people who was really down for me.

Every gangster story is unique because it's coming from a unique person, just like we all got unique fingerprints. The nightmare that I live everyday is from my past. I'm scarred mentally. You know I am sitting here writing about the pain I feel but how did I get this way? Why is it this way I used to carry dope for my big homies, and do anything they ask to earn what I thought was respect. Who is respecting me? Everybody? Hell no. Just from my close circle of friends who were down to kill for me? No. You know they straight turn on me snitch. I trusted them and got stabbed in the back. I was down for years and lived right here in South Central LA. Things ain't the way they used to be. Everybody is out for themselves. It's always been that way though.

I just remember the bodies dropping, the cries of screaming mothers, screaming to God and I can't even say it. You know I heard this song "Theres a dead man walking in the hood". There is a dead man walking in every hood. It's not right to blame anybody for the problems we have created for ourselves. My brother who I loved was murdered. It wasn't my fault and I can't really be mad at the world. Sometimes I thought taking a gun to my head was the only way to get out of this world of misery. I have a lot of questions that I can't answer or get answered. People treat me like I am a threat often. It's like they can see in my eyes the pain, the misery, the evil deeds I done. It hurts everyday that I have to carry an old soul. I've lived a lifetime over and over.

The gang is a group and can a gang can't be stopped. People don't understand that gang members are tight knit groups of friends. When we live in surroundings of hopelessness then we turn to violence to get respect. Does the working man in the business suit going to respect us? No. They look at us as if we are stupid thugs who are not smart enough to know any better. But you know, we choose to live this gang life and we do know it. That's where hopelessness comes in. The greatest human desire to be appreciated, to be looked at as if we were great. To be loved. The greatest desire isn't money. It's bigger then that. I have seen countless dead bodies, people brains blown out on the streets of Los Angeles. A war zone.

The police ride around in armored vehicles raiding houses, flying helicopters, and harassing innocent people. We are the people who just want to work, we just want to live. And I am telling everybody right now that Peace can be real, but force is necessary to get it. We can't let the LAPD continue to step on us. And let me tell you that in no way am I trying to encourage violence. I am only saying that regardless of the gang, there are bad peoples out there. There are some straight killers that will kill and not care. Sociopaths. I know some. I had one homie who would murder people every week. Mostly people of his own racial makeup, black. He was murder kids, parents, and other gang members of rival sets. See the nightmare I have to live? Pieces of shit like this who I was friends with?

Because like I said there are bad people out there. Don't think twice about that. I acknowledge that I have and feel bad about the pain I inflicted on others. The point of these writings is the madness I have to live with, the pain I am in everyday. It develops over the years. I banged for 12 years and I am so scarred mentally I can't even think straight. Read this and I want you to say to yourself "damn, I don't want to end up like this guy". I still try to pull through everyday and have faith in God. But changing is not as easy as it seems. It is a process. I never really had anybody there for me except my family. I was lonely when I had to quit my criminal career. Who else can I fit in with? I banged since I was 11 years old.

I had to catch up with the real world. I see even in the real world everybody bangs, they bang to get that job, they bang to get that new car, that lady friend. Little would we know we bang on other daily, aside from being in a real gang. I called my homie the other day, he's been in his house with a bracelet that beeps whenever he leaves his front yard. It's called house arrest. Imagine that shit. Once it was on my ankle. I am tired and don't want anybody to live my personal pain.

Have hope, have big dreams, think to yourself that you can be somebody and not end up a deadbeat, not end up a mental cripple.

This is no game, this is foreal. Don't hurt anybody to get to the top. The traditional business technique. I want people to start loving one another, care about your peoples. I want you to help a disadvantaged person. It will make you feel better to give back rather then take like the gang members mentality is based on, taking and not giving back. These words are real and come from my heart.

O.G. RK

When you start trying to act "cool", thinking you need to experience this to "be a man",...

"I have to live with the fact that I hurt many people and I hurt myself, I even thought a gunshot or a few would make me a real man. I am partially crippled due to my foolish decisions."

...or do that to "get respect",...

"Why is it this way I used to carry dope for my big homies, and do anything they ask to earn what I thought was respect. Who is respecting me? Everybody? Hell no. Just from my close circle of friends who were down to kill for me? No. You know they straight turn on me snitch. I trusted them and got stabbed in the back. I was down for years and lived right here in South Central LA. Things ain't the way they used to be. Everybody is out for themselves. It's always been that way though."

...you never know where it's going to end.

Maybe you just dress like a banger and hang out, thinking people won't mess with you because they think you're a banger. Maybe you think that since you're not really a banger, you won't get in the trouble. Think again. Even something like that can lead to some gangmembers seeing you, thinking you're from a rival set, and taking a shot.

"And I am telling everybody right now that Peace can be real, but force is necessary to get it. [...] There are some straight killers that will kill and not care. Sociopaths. I know some. I had one homie who would murder people every week. Mostly people of his own racial makeup, black. He was murder kids, parents, and other gang members of rival sets. See the nightmare I have to live? Pieces of shit like this who I was friends with?"

In my opinion, and I think this is what RK is trying to say here, it is because of killers like this guy he describes that the threat of force, from law enforcement (LE) for example, is necessary to intimidate and deter them. In that same paragraph, though, he hints at problems in relations between LE and the civilian community, problems that need to be addressed:

"The police ride around in armored vehicles raiding houses, flying helicopters, and harassing innocent people. We are the people who just want to work, we just want to live. [...] We can't let the LAPD continue to step on us."

"Ganglyfe" is really gangdeath. It's hell-on-earth, homes:

"Sometimes I thought taking a gun to my head was the only way to get out of this world of misery."

Jesus is the way out this world of misery. The nightmare ends when you wake up and come to Jesus.

"This is no game, this is foreal. Don't hurt anybody to get to the top. The traditional business technique. I want people to start loving one another, care about your peoples. I want you to help a disadvantaged person. It will make you feel better to give back rather then take like the gang members mentality is based on, taking and not giving back. These words are real and come from my heart.

O.G. RK"

Gangs: "...dont join in da first place!!!"

I got this in an email:

yo im in a gang now dogg and both of my parents are cuz of gang its just bad im in one cuz of that im in da crips z did a drive by and killed em both but the only way to get out a gang is they kill u or beat u so dont join in da first place!!!

You can get out. I've known many people who have gotten out and gotten their lives together and are now quite happy.

It is hard, though, and it's scary. Many gangs do threaten to kill you or at least beat the stuffings out of you if you try to leave.

But, many gangmembers do respect Jesus Christ, and they often will respect a sincere desire on the part of a gangmember to leave gangdeath (notice how I write "gangdeath" instead of "ganglife") behind and come to Jesus. I think part of the reason is that most of the gangmembers are just as scared and want out just as much as the member who is leaving.

People don't understand words like "sin" and "salvation" -- they don't understand when you tell them that they commit sin and Jesus is here for their salvation.

So, let's use words like "mistakes" and "fixing them" instead.

We all make mistakes, and Jesus is here to fix them for us. Joining a gang is a mistake -- a very big one!

God knows more than we do. He gives us advice on what to do and what not to do. We do things our way, though, instead of His way -- those are mistakes, and they carry consequences. God has mercy on us, and has sent His Son Jesus Christ to fix our mistakes and save us from their consequences.

Get with Jesus and stay there.

Especially those of you who think you already are with Jesus -- get closer.

Who's a Gangmember?

From the City of Madison, WI, Police Department's DANE COUNTY NARCOTICS AND GANG TASK FORCE -- GANGS - FREQUENTLY ASKED QUESTIONS:

"STREET GANG MEMBER":

An individual shall be considered a "Street Gang Member" when that person meets any one of the following criteria:

1. When the individual admits membership in a gang.

2. When a law enforcement agency or reliable informant identifies an individual as a gang member.

3. When an informant of previously untested reliability identifies an individual as a gang member, and it is corroborated by independent information.

4. When the individual resides in or frequents a particular gang's area and affects their style of dress, use of hand signs, symbols or tattoos, and/or maintains ongoing relationships with known gang members; or has been arrested several times in the company of identified gang members for offenses which are consistent with usual gang activity; and where the law enforcement officer believes there is reasonable suspicion that the individual is involved in gang-related criminal activity or enterprise.

"STREET GANG AFFILIATE":

An individual who does not meet the criteria for a "Street Gang Member," but is known to affiliate with active gang members, and law enforcement personnel have established a reasonable suspicion that the individual is involved in criminal activity or enterprise, or promotes the criminal activity of a gang.

What jumps out to me is No. 4 under the definitions of a Street Gang Member.

Even if a young person is just hanging around with gang members, that young person runs a very serious risk of suffering in the same fate as the gangmembers.

If you dress like a banger, if you act like a banger, if you hang around with bangers, you are considered a banger.

Not only will the Madison, WI, Police Department treat you like a banger, but rival gangs will, too. When they do a drive-by shooting, they are not going to stop and ask you technicalities about whether you have been properly initiated into your set; they're just going to open fire, then beat it.

This is why acquaintances and family members of gangbangers have an alarming tendency to die violently.

And that is part of the reason ganglife is so painful. Bangers watch even the relatively innocent people in their lives get gunned down in the crossfire.

Then, they want to take revenge, so they go and shoot at the people that they believe are their enemies (they're not checking ID's either), and more people die.

Then someone avenges that, and the violence continues....

Isn't that kewel...?

Getting Out of a Gang

Institute for Governmental Research: FAQs about Gangs. (See original for hyperlinks to sources.)

Are youth gangs involved in organized crime?

The “gang” characterization is sometimes broadly extended to mean terrorist gang, prison gang, or criminal gang as in organized crime, and “in each of these instances, the word ‘gang’ implies a level of structure and organization for criminal conspiracy that is simply beyond the capacity of most street gangs” (Klein, 2004: 57). To remain in business, organized crime groups such as drug cartels must have strong leadership, codes of loyalty, severe sanctions for failure to abide by these codes, and a level of entrepreneurial expertise that enables them to accumulate and invest proceeds from drug sales (p. 58). In contrast, “most street gangs are only loosely structured, with transient leadership and membership, easily transcended codes of loyalty, and informal rather than formal roles for the members” (p. 59). Very few youth gangs meet the essential criteria for classification as “organized crime” (see also Decker, Bynum, and Weisel, 1998; Weisel, 2002).

The loose structure discussed above helps explain why, despite threats that a member is in a gang for life and will be killed if he or she tries to leave, many street gang members who try to leave are able to do so successfully.

But, read on....

How do youths become involved in and leave a gang?

[...] research has documented that former gang members, especially marginal and short-term ones, typically left the gang without complication or facing any serious consequences (Decker and Lauritsen, 2002; Decker and Van Winkle, 1996). However, for the more long-term and/or core members, the process of leaving the gang is likely to be more gradual and met with greater difficulty—particularly for youths in more highly organized gangs that have a firmer foothold in a community or neighborhood. Other situational factors that make leaving the gang more difficult include greater dependence on or personal status in the group, continuing perceptions by others (e.g., rivals) that the person is a bona fide member of the gang, and the lack of viable lifestyle alternatives (that is, conventional pursuits such as employment opportunities). Further, more hierarchically structured gangs may threaten or enact certain sanctions for those wishing to leave the gang.

Organization, habit, criminal record and associations are significant factors. Younger kids in loosely affiliated street gangs have an easier time getting out than experienced gangmembers who are involved in more organized criminal endeavors. Still, it is possible even for "hardened criminals" to change their lives.

Younger gangmembers: get out now, while you still can!

More experienced gangmembers: get out now, because you still can!

Eze 18:20-23 "The soul who sins shall die. The son shall not bear the guilt of the father, nor the father bear the guilt of the son. The righteousness of the righteous shall be upon himself, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon himself.

But if a wicked man turns from all his sins which he has committed, keeps all My statutes, and does what is lawful and right, he shall surely live; he shall not die. None of the transgressions which he has committed shall be remembered against him; because of the righteousness which he has done, he shall live. Do I have any pleasure at all that the wicked should die?" says the Lord God, "and not that he should turn from his ways and live?"

God does not judge you the way people judge you.

To Him, you are a hardened criminal only as long as you harden your heart and refuse to change. The moment you turn to Him and seek help and healing, you are like a new-born child ("born again"), and He will be happy to work with you.

When you continue to do what is wrong, when you continue to do what hurts yourself and others, this saddens Him; but He is very happy when you decide to change your ways. He loves you, and is very pleased when you turn to Him and give Him the chance to help you. He knows you need it -- and you know it, too.

Eze 18:27-28 "Again, when a wicked man turns away from the wickedness which he committed, and does what is lawful and right, he preserves himself alive. Because he considers and turns away from all the transgressions which he committed, he shall surely live; he shall not die."

Getting Started in Gangs

Institute for Governmental Research: FAQs about Gangs. (See original for hyperlinks to sources.)

Are today's youth gangs different from gangs in the past?

Some of the gangs that have emerged in the past decade are noticeably different from those that emerged before the mid-1980s (Howell, Egley, and Gleason, 2002; Howell, Moore, and Egley, 2002). These gangs are commonly described as having a “hybrid gang culture,” meaning they do not follow the same rules or methods of operation, making documentation and categorization difficult (Starbuck et al., 2001). They may have several of the following characteristics: a mixture of racial/ethnic groups, a mixture of symbols and graffiti associated with different gangs, wearing colors traditionally associated with a rival gang, less concern over turf or territory, and members who sometimes switch from one gang to another. Members of contemporary gangs often “cut and paste” bits of Hollywood images and big-city gang lore into their local versions of gangs. Small town and rural gangs also differ from urban gangs in other important respects (Howell, Egley, and Gleason, 2002), hence urban models of gang development and response do not necessarily apply in rural areas (Weisheit and Wells, 2004).

To me, what this one above indicates is the possibility for a group of wannabes to become a gang by trying to imitate behavior they see in the movies or become aware of through music or videogames. When it comes to taking kids down the wrong path, every little bit can hurt.


What are the major risk factors for gang membership?

Risk factors that predispose many youths to gang membership are also linked to a variety of adolescent problem behaviors, including serious violence and delinquency. The major risk factor domains are individual characteristics, family conditions, school experiences and performance, peer group influences, and the community context. Risk factors predictive of gang membership include prior and/or early involvement in delinquency, especially violence and alcohol/drug use; poor family management and problematic parent-child relations; low school attachment and achievement and negative labeling by teachers; association with aggressive peers and peers who engage in delinquency; and neighborhoods in which large numbers of youth are in trouble and in which drugs and firearms are readily available (Howell and Egley, 2005; see also Esbensen, 2000; Hill, Lui, and Hawkins, 2001; Thornberry, 1998; Wyrick and Howell, 2004). The accumulation of risk factors greatly increases the likelihood of gang involvement, just as it does for other problem behaviors. The presence of risk factors in multiple risk-factor domains appears to increase the likelihood of gang involvement even more (Thornberry et al., 2003). A complete enumeration of risk factors for juvenile delinquency and gang involvement and data indicators can be accessed at the National Youth Gang Center Web site (http://www.iir.com/nygc/tool/).

"Risk factors predictive of gang membership include [...] negative labeling by teachers[.]"

In my short time teaching in the public schools, I saw enough of that. I tried not to do it, but it takes constant vigilance. I can only imagine a young kid teacher (No offense intended to you young kid teachers!), fresh out of college and overwhelmed with "bad" kids (There! I just labeled them!), or a teacher who has been dealing with "thugs" (I did it again!) for many years.

We are very blessed that God doesn't write us off, the way I so often have written others off, but rather, that He insists on saving us, and sent His Son to do so.

A Teacher with a Student Who is Trying to Leave a Gang

I recently had an email from a teacher who expressed concern about a student she had in his early teens who was involved with gangs. I offered her my thoughts regarding the situation, and she answered me very positively: "It's good to have someone to talk to about the hard stuff."

It was very rewarding and humbling that what I had to offer seemed to be so genuinely appreciated. I post the key elements of the situation and of my response here, with the hope that they will be of use to others, as well. The information has been sanitized to eliminate references to any specifics.

The basics of the problem is that a male gangmember in his early teens was in trouble with law enforcement for a drug-related issue, which, in turn, was gang-related. The gangmember expressed an interest to this teacher to leave the gang, and she wanted to know what to do to help him. My response was:

In circumstances like this, a coordinated approach, involving law enforcement, school staff, parents and clergy has often worked.

It goes like this: the gangmember decides he wants to get away from the gang. Of course, the gangs always say you can't leave. However, nearly all gangs usually respect a sincere desire to leave the gang and turn to God. So, the now-soon-to-be-former gangmember gets the cops, school, the family and clergy involved, and tells them he (or she) just wants to leave the gang -- not tell on them, just walk away -- and turn to God.

With this support network in place, the gang has nothing to lose by letting him go, since the member is not telling anyone, especially the cops, details about the gang. However, the gang does have something to lose by messing with the former member, since everybody knows that the person is leaving the gang, and anything bad that happens the gang will be investigated first. If the member has difficulties, the school, family and clergy can work together to help steer him on the right track.

[ ... ]

To me, the key is to get Jesus involved in his life to open doors for him. As a teacher, presumably in a public school, First Amendment considerations may prevent you from evangelizing. However, nothing prevents you from reporting what you were told is an effective strategy. If the student asks your personal opinion on it, you would then be free to offer your opinion.

Another key feature is attitude.

Please relay to him from me the following advice:

Change your life. Change the way you dress, so you don't look like a banger. Change the way you act -- you may not realize it, but to some extent you act, and react, like a banger. In short, change everything that might make someone think you are a banger. They will stop associating you with gangs, and the gang problems will leave you alone.

Many people think that just by moving somewhere different, they can get away. But, without realizing it, they take with themselves the same attitude, dress and mannerisms that let others know they are gang-affiliated. So, even though they are trying to avoid trouble, trouble finds them.

A friend of mine was a banger on the northwest side of [a major American city]. He moved to the south side, deep in a rival gang's country. Nobody knew him in the new hood, and his homies from the old hood wouldn't go to that part of town. He changed the way he dressed, talked, acted. He started going to church, got married. Today, he's a devout Christian, happily married with kids, his wife has a nice job, he's going to college, and his job as a security guard allows him to study on the clock. Now he can kind of joke about his past.

Get with Jesus, and ask Jesus to show you the way. Jesus will be happy to show you how to get out of trouble, because He hung on a cross exactly to get you out of trouble.

In her response, the teacher expressed concern about involving herself in the situation, due to possible ramifications for her family. She also commented about how other faculty members were already working with this student, including some who were more specifically detailed to deal with these types of problems. Consequently, she was allowing the other faculty to take the lead in this situation.

The basis for concern seemed to be that she felt she knew very little about gang-related issues.

My comments were as follows:

For some kids, the "fond" memories of what they did with their gang buddies are overpoweringly tempting, and they backslide. Some kids aren't very sincere to begin with; they're just hoping to get out of trouble with the authorities that they are currently in. But, it is important that the kids have somewhere other than the gang to turn to.

If there is that much concern about a gang problem in your community, then, as a teacher, I suggest you visit our website. Reading the message boards could be especially enlightening: http://www.streetgangstyle.com/gs/board/listboards.php

After spending two to three hours a week over the course of several months, you'll be much better prepared to identify gang-related issues and you'll have a better handle on how to deal with them.

One of the best things you can do is just be there for the kids. They have parents who often don't understand them, or who have problems themselves; they have teachers who are so often too inundated with workload and bureaucracy to help them. They have friends, who are just as lost as they are. What they really need are authority figures who will take the time to get to know them and help them out.

What I'm recommending here is legitimate professional concern. Let some of the kids come in and sit with you before or after school for a little while. Help them with their homework, and maybe they can help you decorate the classroom. Solicit their input in preparing class activities and assignments. And, be ready to listen to them. Learn about what kind of resources are available in your community for drug-related, gang-related and rape-related issues. When you come across a particularly bad problem, steer the little gal or guy in the appropriate direction for the help needed.

You can be a real light for them in a world that is usually dark and scary. And, they will love you for it. Your Creator will appreciate it, too.

Seek the Lord's help with all the issues you face in life. Nothing is too small or too trivial for Him. He created you, He knows all about you; nothing should be too embarassing to bring to Him.

On the contrary, if you think that a matter is too unimportant or embarassing to address with God, then that matter and its associated concerns become a small barrier between you and Him, and that is not good: what you want is for Him to show you how to solve your problems.